Thanal Online - Volume 2. Issue 1. July 2007

"Organized religion divides people, whereas literature unites people"

INTERVIEW WITH GEORGE TRIALONIS
By : Farideh Hassanzadeh –Mostafavi

Who is George Trialonis ?

I found George Trialonis in the e-magazine : Thanal online ,devoted to the world poetry. His poems seemed simple but not easy ; deep but not pedantic . Among other poets in that issue he was like a piece of cloud , flying in a blue sky . I mean his poetry conveys the fresh smell of rain.
He is a poet from Greece, the land of most beautiful myths and greatest poets like Yannis Ritsos. He studied psychology and philosophy in American and Canadian universities and now works as a translator/interpreter. He kindly edits my translations of Iran classic and contemporary poetry for introducing to the world. http://gtrialonis.googlepages.com

How do you interpret the September 11th tragedy?

Although I am not one of those people who are inspired by conspiracy theories, I believe that the 9/11 tragedy was an “inside job”. Neither Bin Laden nor Saddam was involved.

What is the relationship between literature and religion?

I take it that by ‘religion’ you mean organized religion, not the personal practices related to faith, but the larger shared or communal systems of thought about an unseen being, person, or object that is considered to be supernatural, sacred, divine, or of the highest truth. In this sense religion divides people, whereas literature unites people. Literature “exposes” the human condition in ways that are entertaining and educative; it elevates the mind and, unlike ‘religion’, makes no claims for absolute truth. In this sense, literature respects people and their freedom to espouse ideas that better meet their intellectual needs. On the contrary, organized religion is dogmatic, inflexible and intolerant. It nurtures fanaticism, bigotry and hatred for the “infidel” other. I have great respect for the personal beliefs of others, but am indifferent to ‘religion’. I agree with Einstein who said that “True religion is real living; living with all one's soul, with all one's goodness and righteousness.”

Marilyn Krysl says: "Globalization really means that rich countries exploit poor countries ". What is your interpretation?

I know a lot of people who react to globalization seeing that its effects infringe upon their individual rights and interests. To explain this by an analogy, let us assume that the world as a big house with many rooms, each allocated to one family member. Also, that not all members are equal in terms of wealth: some are poor, others less poor and others well off, etc., and that not all rooms are the same - some are small, others smaller and, still, others are large or larger. Also, some rooms have better views or their furniture and furnishings are of higher value, even sentimental value for the persons occupying them. Now, there comes a time when the more affluent room occupants decide amongst themselves that their rooms are too small for them to reap the benefits of, for example, advanced stereo systems or to wash and dry their ‘dirty’ laundry. So, they decide, without the consent of the less affluent, to break down dividing walls to improve the acoustics of the house or make space for their laundry. Of course, this is done at the expense of the less affluent occupants who see that their space is violated and are not allowed to utilize the equipment and furniture of the affluent occupants of the house. Actually, this situation is imposed on them. Of course this analogy is not very successful as it disregards the economic aspect of globalization and focuses more on its territorial and cultural aspects. But it clearly shows that there is exploitation and injustice in the world.

What is bothersome for you?

There are a lot of things that bother me, for example when I see people sitting around doing nothing. In Greece there are a lot of popular coffee shops where middle aged men, usually pensioners, go there to chit-chat or talk about nothing and everything. To me this is utter waste of time because they could be doing something constructive. Socializing is good, but people must find time to spend with themselves, alone.

Iranian poet Maryam Ala Amjadi says " all writers, even the male, write with a feminine soul. After all, the Muses were goddesses and not gods. "What do you think about this theory?

I can’t explain why, but your question pops into my mind the female figurines of the Neolithic and Bronze Age which archaeologists discovered in Greece (Crete) and Turkey depicting corpulent or pregnant women. This is evidence that the belief in divinity had been centered on the female (Great Mother: Nature, the giver and nurturer of life, the goddess of fertility). In this sense I agree with the theory: poets and artists produce their work per force of a female soul/mind or have intellectual qualities specific to the female of our species. Also, this male vs. female distinction touches only the superficial or the mundane characteristics between people. What is important in art is the manifestation of the Spirit, not so much of the forms it takes, although the latter afford aesthetic pleasure and provide cause for distinctions.

“I feel that if real poetry were written, the pen would break into half, for it would not possibly tolerate the madness, the originality, the genuine poem.” This is another saying by Maryam Ala Amjadi . Do you agree?

Well, to answer your question properly I would have to define ‘real poetry’ and ‘genuine poem’. But I would rather not, lest I make a fool of myself. What I know from personal experience is that poetic composition (poiesis) will not flourish unless one is ‘beside himself/herself’, i.e. in a state of mind which transcends the mundane, even for a few seconds. In this mental frame – call it ‘madness’, if you will – I am overwhelmed by emotions and physical sensations (I cannot explain why these are localized in my abdominal area) which push for their physical manifestation or investment with form. In this condition the physical mediums of poetic composition may not withstand the force by which the Spirit pushes for expression – ‘rupture’ or ‘explosion’ may be the natural consequence, just as in birth or in the genesis of the cosmos.

Proust says: “If I did not have poetry, great literature, music to listen to, I would not have survived my sorrows.” May I know what your reasons for writing poetry are?

I am in search of meaning, not so much in life, as in the world inside me. This world is unique for every person, in terms of emotions and feelings that can hardly be put into words. The more words you use to describe it, the more you distance yourself from it. Poetry, with its economy in words, cadence and allegorical nature, is a means for interpreting and sharing personal sensibilities with other people.

Let’s admit that finding solitude for a man to stay home and write is as natural as for a woman to peel onion in the kitchen. Even in societies where equality is not the slogan among men and women, she feels uneasy with the circumstances when she sits behind a desk to write; she feels unusual, as if she has betrayed others. Her conscious suffers from the guilt that she might have robbed others’ rights. If you do not agree with this statement, then, would you please express what is the difference between Women’s Literature, and Men’s Literature?

As for “…Her conscious suffers from guilt that she might have robbed other’s rights.” I am a man and feel the same way when I have overextended my work in the office, knowing that I have to be at home preparing lunch and/or dinner for the family. This is particularly true in summer, when my wife is away from home long hours and our younger boy is alone in the house. Now, as for “…differences between Women’s Literature and Men’s Literature”: this is difficult to answer even if one had researched all literature in the world and analyzed it statistically. Certainly there are differences among authors in terms of subject matter and style. But if you test these differences against the gender factor, you may be surprised to find that some literary genres are statistically significant, and others are not, against the gender factor. In ‘good’ poetry, for example, which is the result of imagination, the man vs. woman difference I expect to be statistically insignificant, because imagination is beyond forms and I believe that such differences are more culturally determined

The Turkish poet Enis Batur writes: “If ‘Death’ didn’t exist, Mankind would never write poetry. He would never need it.” The Iranian poet Soufi writes: “Everyone fears death: Poets fear it more.” How do you interpret this? To what extent do you agree with it?

I agree more with the first statement and less with the second. Death is the major theme of poetry. It inspires poets more than anything else. Treatment of the subject is either direct, with references to ‘death’, ‘suicide’, ‘murder’, etc. or indirect, with references to the changing of the seasons and the cycles of life. Death is the common denominator for all people – rich and poor, literate and illiterate, kings and paupers. Its ‘icy’ grip on human imagination is the strongest. It brings people face to face with the question, “What lies beyond death? Will I be able to remember, to act, to create?” At least this is how I feel. I take this opportunity to quote one of my earliest poems, which I penned more than twenty years ago:

Must I?
To create;that is our banner.
To create, for we shall die.
How sad this knowledge is.
Hope is hidden in a lie.

This “Must I?” I intended to mean “Must I Die?” It is a question which may be posed by any poet to their Maker. Surely, if death did not exist, poetry and many other things would not exist either, not even life as we know it! But what is death, if not a passage from one state of consciousness to another? What is death, if not the “life-blood” or the essence of Life? In this sense death is not the negation of life – that would be a lie.

Would you like to visit my country? What do you know of Iran? Which Iranian writers are you acquainted with?

Yes, I would very much like to visit Iran. Unfortunately, I know very little about your country or Iranian writers. I was very pleased a few days ago when I heard a Greek person on the local radio recounting his experience from a tour to Tehran. He said that the Iranians and the Greeks look very much alike, but the Iranians are more kind and honor their poets. He was also fascinated by the cleanliness of the streets and the warm hospitality. Greeks are hospitable, too, but quite careless with their physical environment.

What would you ever do, if there was no poetry?

What would a bee be or do if there were no flowers? What would a worm be or do, if there was no decay of the flesh or death? I am sorry to answer your question with two questions, but you are asking me to imagine the unimaginable.